Engine help - GSXR.com
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post #1 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-10-2017, 09:10 PM Thread Starter
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Engine help

Hello all... I picked up a used 1000 motor and did the swap on my 600. I got everything installed and started it with no problems. The second day the motor started spitting out a ton of blue smoke. I figure maybe from sitting out might need to be run. I take the bike out and it pulls hard! I look in the mirrors and thus thing is bellowing so much smoke you'd think this was James Bond's super smoke screen mod.

I get the bike back home and year it back down to have a look at the plugs. The cylinder closest to the clutch lever has oil on it and the rest just carbon. I also noticed that I've got oil getting into the exhaust system. I figured it couldn't be rings because the bike pulls way harder than the 750 I had swapped out.

I'm leaning towards a worn valve seal as the culprit. My oil looked perfectly fine and so did my coolant. If anyone has any ideas that could help if really appreciate some insight.
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post #2 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-10-2017, 11:10 PM
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Valve seal will only smoke at start up mostly. That much smoke means piston/ring damage. The oil control ring is probably wasted.
Its directly below the top two rings.
Unfortunately, you'll need to pull motor and top end and inspect.
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post #3 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 04:20 AM Thread Starter
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Dang it..... That's not what I wanted to hear but much appreciated
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post #4 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 05:28 AM
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A leak down test comparing all the cylinders might tell you more, but I think Racerxxxgsxr1000 is correct. You have a lemon used motor.

I'm assuming that it's not overfilled with oil as you said the "oil looked perfectly fine".

There was a recent thread where someone played a "joke" and poured oil into the tail pipe but that is reaching. Especially with the oily plug.

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post #5 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 07:14 AM Thread Starter
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I wish it was a joke! How is it the engine pulls so string but leaking oil and no misfire? It runs perfectly fine at idle.
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post #6 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 07:23 AM
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Would a blocked or faulty PCV valve cause such problems?

I am a ward of the state.
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post #7 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-11-2017, 10:56 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleangsxr600 View Post
I wish it was a joke! How is it the engine pulls so string but leaking oil and no misfire? It runs perfectly fine at idle.
You can still have compression with oil getting by, and often that oil passing by heavily will seal compression loss. It just smokes like a freight train.
I'd start by testing each cylinder like John mentioned, if bad pull head and look at cylinders by moving pistons up and down for each.

Sorry to hear brotha. Sometimes we win and sometimes we dont.

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post #8 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-12-2017, 06:00 AM Thread Starter
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Thanks for the help. I plan to take this advice and do a leak down test this weekend. I'll let you guys know if I get lucky or need a go fund me account to get me outta jail ?
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post #9 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-28-2017, 03:50 AM Thread Starter
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Ok so I got around to the leak down and compressor test. Cylinder 3 was leaking and had oil on the top of the piston when I got the head off. Compression numbers were pretty low on all cylinders ranging from 120psi (cylinder 1) to 80psi (by cylinder 4). I know bummer!

So now I'm in the process of cleaning things up and am ready to buy bearings. I'm trying to understand this whole clearance thing and it's a little confusing. The bearings appear to have the brown color code on them. So from what I understand I don't just go by color code I need to measure with a micrometer and dial bore gauge right?

I've found the code on the crank and it reads just like the service manual L2222R and the rods read 2 which says I need brown. However I'm going with a different rod and piston set so will the main bearings stay the same? And do I install the old bearings in the new rods to get a reference for the new rod bearing choice? The rods didn't come with a spec card so it's making things a little more difficult.

Thanks in advance for any and all help.
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post #10 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 08:20 AM Thread Starter
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So we don't have any engine guru's that can help with oil clearance?
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post #11 of 32 (permalink) Old 04-30-2017, 09:17 AM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleangsxr600 View Post
So we don't have any engine guru's that can help with oil clearance?
So you have some year 1k engine put in some year 600 bike with non-stock rods and probably a worn crank. That is why I didn't respond earlier. I would have no clue with the information you provide.

All the specs are in the manual, you just need to get a some micrometers out, measure all the I.D.s and O.D.s and see what will match up. Confirm everything with plastigage.

I'll suggest you take the crank and connecting rods to an engine or machine shop and let them measure them for you.

The crankshaft journals will be the same if not damaged.

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If you think reading is tricky, how the hell are you going to follow troubleshooting directions?
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post #12 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 12:37 PM Thread Starter
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That's good advice... Thanks
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post #13 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 12:40 PM Thread Starter
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I just bought a micrometer to measure the journals. Are those "T" type mics used for the inside of the rods?
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post #14 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:04 PM Thread Starter
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And the 1k engine is 02
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post #15 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:05 PM
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Or buy a set of these and use an outside micrometer to take the dimension. Much less expensive.
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckster View Post
If you think reading is tricky, how the hell are you going to follow troubleshooting directions?
"Riding well is difficult, riding poorly is easy and painful."
- Nick Ienatsch


"We're all here because we're not all there" - Guy Favron on Gold Rush

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post #16 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:07 PM Thread Starter
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And the bike is an 01 gsxr 600
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post #17 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:10 PM Thread Starter
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Those were what I was referring to when I wrote "T" type. Thanks for the help and sorry for the lack of info that I didn't give.
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post #18 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 01:13 PM
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Quote:
Originally Posted by cleangsxr600 View Post
I just bought a micrometer to measure the journals. Are those "T" type mics used for the inside of the rods?
A dial bore gauge is best for measuring cylinders and if they are oval shaped due to wear. The snap "T" gauges are ok, but you'll need a good micrometer to measure those.

Crank bearings are entirely dependent on how much journal wear you have. If all your journals are in spec, you can usually use the color code bearings they recommend. But no matter what you decide, all ways plasti-gauge. Keep in mind if your rod or crank turns even slightly when torqueing, the plasti-gauge wont give a correct indication.

Any rod bolts you remove must be replaced, their torque values are based with rod bolt stretch taken in account on their torque numbers.

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post #19 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 03:31 PM Thread Starter
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I do have a dual bore gauge. I've tried looking at YouTube on how to use them but the way they come up with the numbers for clearance is confusing.
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post #20 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 03:34 PM Thread Starter
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About the rod bolts....I have new bolts but when I torque then down in the plasti gauge procedure do I need to replace them again or crank them back down in final reassembly?
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post #21 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 04:00 PM
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Just torque them to about 20 ft/lbs. That will fully seat the plain bearings and not be near enough to stretch bolts.

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post #22 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 05:36 PM Thread Starter
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Understood... Thanks. If I get it right the rebuild should be sick! High compression, h-beam rods, ported heads, cams, and adjustable gears. Hoping to surprise a few people.
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post #23 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-03-2017, 05:44 PM
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It does get expensive real quick. Many people just try to get a low mileage motor and swap if they are good with stock.

Just a nice set of quality cams cam easily be 900.00
Keep in mind, if those cylinders have any damage, they will need to be recoated, they do not have steel liners.
They are "Nikasyl" it is a specific metal coating over aluminum.
I cant remember how thick the coating is, something like .030" thick.

If the coating hasn't flaked and the look good "and not oval" you can probably just install pistons. I do not recommend honing either.

If there is damage, you'll need to send the cylinders out for recoating.

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Last edited by Racerxxxgsxr1000; 05-03-2017 at 06:12 PM.
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post #24 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-09-2017, 03:36 PM Thread Starter
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The cylinders are in pretty good shape. I was wondering about the honing though. The Manuel says don't home either but the wiseco directing said the cylinders must be deglazed.
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post #25 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-09-2017, 06:48 PM
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I think this will answer your question.

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Quote:
Originally Posted by Chuckster View Post
If you think reading is tricky, how the hell are you going to follow troubleshooting directions?
"Riding well is difficult, riding poorly is easy and painful."
- Nick Ienatsch


"We're all here because we're not all there" - Guy Favron on Gold Rush

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post #26 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-15-2017, 07:49 PM Thread Starter
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Thanks rv6john... That was very helpful.
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post #27 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-15-2017, 08:01 PM Thread Starter
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Hello everyone....I need someone to tell me what the third and fourth lines a represent. I know the top is the crankshaft balancer, the second is for the crankshaft journals but I'm not sure about lines three and four. Does anybody know? These come off the upper crankcase housing.
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post #28 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-16-2017, 04:44 AM
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Picture is too small and fuzzy, can't read it.

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post #29 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-16-2017, 06:37 AM Thread Starter
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It reads...
AA
1B
AB
BB
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post #30 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-16-2017, 07:21 AM
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You want some hard truth? You're asking some pretty basic questions when it comes to an engine rebuild. I think you're in over your head. Doesn't mean you can't learn, but this just isn't the time to do so. It sounds like you're dropping in some higher end components, and that means you're putting it all at risk with your lack of skills. All the cash you're dropping into parts might go up in smoke the first time you ride it because it wasn't done right.

IMHO, send the engine into someplace like KWS or Livengood and pay them for a refresh. You'll pay a little more up front, but you'll be sure it was done correctly.
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post #31 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-16-2017, 09:09 PM Thread Starter
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If the goal is for me to learn this basic stuff and that's what I'm trying to do posting someone to do a refresh defeats the purpose wouldn't you say? It's plenty of people around Atlanta that could do my refresh such as living good Motorsports.

However as it said in the title "engine help". My goal is to learn so concern about what I'm spending shouldn't become a topic. Passing on knowledge should be though. Thanks for all the help from my fellow enthusiasts who can understand where I'm coming from.
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post #32 of 32 (permalink) Old 05-18-2017, 09:01 AM
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Your money, your call. IMHO, a sport bike engine isn't the place to learn how to rebuild an engine. Didn't say you'd like my answer.
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