MotoGP going to 800cc

MotoGP is reporting that they will be going from the current liter format to an 800cc engine starting next year. They say they are doing it to make it safer, but you would think the manufacturers would be against this. Here's why...MotoGP has always been used as a testbed for new technology and this technology has been geared for current production which has always been the 600cc and the 1000cc. Since there are no 800cc motorcycles, do you all think this is going to make a difference to the engineers and manufacturers? Will there be an 800cc line coming out in the future?

It wouldn't surprise me at all to see 800cc sportbikes in the near future. There's a good chance that this might also put a spark back into the 750cc war again. The Gixxer 750 is the lonely king at the top for the moment.

The Gixxer 750 is the lonely king at the top for the moment. and we rule the world..........hahahahahah

mmm... 800 sounds just right for my next bike

I heard, and this is ONLY SPECULATION, that because of the move to 800cc the big 4 companies will be able to make their street bikes look like the Moto GP bikes in 1000cc class. Because everything used in the Gran Prix is supposed to be prototype they were not allowed to mock the look for mass produced bikes. Now they may be able to make future bike models look like those bikes since they won't be in use again. Like I said only a rumor may or may not be true. What do you all think? I know yamaha produced some street legal M1s in Europe last year with the LE but they were super expensive and made only a couple to release. they were all bought up by the super rich obviously. And Ducati made a Desmo street legal look a like. So I don't know, but it would be cool to see those flush fairing on stock street bikes.

mmm... 800 sounds just right for my next bike +1

+1 1000cc CUMMON :D

I heard, and this is ONLY SPECULATION, that because of the move to 800cc the big 4 companies will be able to make their street bikes look like the Moto GP bikes in 1000cc class. Because everything used in the Gran Prix is supposed to be prototype they were not allowed to mock the look for mass produced bikes. Now they may be able to make future bike models look like those bikes since they won't be in use again. Like I said only a rumor may or may not be true. What do you all think? I know yamaha produced some street legal M1s in Europe last year with the LE but they were super expensive and made only a couple to release. they were all bought up by the super rich obviously. And Ducati made a Desmo street legal look a like. So I don't know, but it would be cool to see those flush fairing on stock street bikes. Make sense to me. Race on Sunday, sell on Monday.

1000cc's CUM ON ME :D had to

yup they have been talking about switching to 800cc for over a year and test have already begun as capirossi and rossi have tested and road their 800cc...I dont believe this will affect manufacturers in a big way as World Superbike and British SuperBike and AMA still have their own 600 and 1000cc league. Maybe manufacturers will make 750's or 800cc. As for Race on Sunday sell on Monday i think Suzuki was doing that for the liter bikes and honda w/ 600rr was doing the same thing in the past few years. Yamaha in the coming years if everything falls in place like now will definitely be selling alot of their bikes as they have already taken Supersport with hacking, looking very good w/ Formula Extreme, and SuperStock. Motogp bikes might be a guide to future evolutions of superbikes that we ride and race but WSB, AMA, & BSB are still the place to race on sunday sell on monday. The bikes in this 3 leagues are the same bike that can be bought by a customer and possibly tune them to race in orgs, run in track, and ride around twisties.

^^^ Nice post. :clap: MotoGP is a good test bed for technologies, and has the influence & prestige over other leagues. Honda was using moto GP to sell the 1000 & 600RR for a while (remember the RC211V & 600RR magazine adds?). I think we can expect the "As used in MotoGP" from manufacturers for months to come. GP technology in the showrooms... Bring it on. :cheers:

^^^ Nice post. :clap: MotoGP is a good test bed for technologies, and has the influence & prestige over other leagues. Honda was using moto GP to sell the 1000 & 600RR for a while (remember the RC211V & 600RR magazine adds?). I think we can expect the "As used in MotoGP" from manufacturers for months to come. GP technology in the showrooms... Bring it on. :cheers: Yup honda still brags and tells about how 600rr is the most closely defined motogp bike, rc211v. last time i check rc211v is a V5 250hp and 600rr is a four banger. The aero and design is very similar to an rc211v and maybe the chassis but i am not sure.

As I recall, the two strokes were limited to 500cc. When they decided to let four strokes into the races, they thought that a 1000cc four stroke would be the equivalent of a 500cc two stroke. I think Barry Sheene said "and they are going to put that equation to death". So the four strokes and the two strokes were running at the same time, but the four strokes were more powerful. Two stokes became a victim of Darwin do to this. So, 800cc is more than likely just putting the equation back were it should of been. They are testing the prototypes right now. From: http://www.speedtv.com/articles/moto/motogp/31548/ "Whist improving the M1 was the number one priority for the team, Rossi also had his first chance to ride the prototype of Yamaha’s 2007 800cc bike. The Italian completed four laps with the bike on Monday and had planned another short run today, but more rain in the late afternoon curtailed this and he was forced to stop after just a couple of laps." Now what would be so cool, to me, is if the two strokes had a fighting chance now. Those bikes are vicious monsters. "A bike from another world", Rossi said. I really liked the two strokes ...

As I recall, the two strokes were limited to 500cc. When they decided to let four strokes into the races, they thought that a 1000cc four stroke would be the equivalent of a 500cc two stroke. I think Barry Sheene said "and they are going to put that equation to death". So the four strokes and the two strokes were running at the same time, but the four strokes were more powerful. Two stokes became a victim of Darwin do to this. Yup i remember watching that from Faster & faster. Two strokers are very dangerous as you roll on the throttle power is still coming then bang your on a high side. With these 4 stroke and aid of traction control you pretty much have to wanna high side to fly over the bars. Last viscious high side was of Hopper last yr. You tend to see more low side with the motogp bikes and that is why Rossi and others say 4 stroke is fun but 500cc is more diffficult to ride. I believe the most recent issue of Racer X touches on this topic about 4 stroke motogp bikes likely to low side than high side and how 250cc motogp riders are having a much easier time adjusting to motogp bikes compared to superbike riders jumping to motogp bikes. Its a definite good read. Another mag touches on this too but am away from my place to find out which mag its on.

800cc yami doesn't sound bad to me at all... Suzuki may drop production on the 750.. no need to have 2 mid range bikes

800cc yami doesn't sound bad to me at all... Suzuki may drop production on the 750.. no need to have 2 mid range bikes i havent hear suzuki producing a 800cc yet. suzuki is doing quite well with the 750.

MotoGP is reporting that they will be going from the current liter format to an 800cc engine starting next year. They say they are doing it to make it safer, but you would think the manufacturers would be against this. Here's why...MotoGP has always been used as a testbed for new technology and this technology has been geared for current production which has always been the 600cc and the 1000cc. Since there are no 800cc motorcycles, do you all think this is going to make a difference to the engineers and manufacturers? Will there be an 800cc line coming out in the future? They talked about going to 800cc MotoGP bikes 2 years ago bro. It was finally comfirmed last year that MotoGP will be switching to 800cc.

i havent hear suzuki producing a 800cc yet. suzuki is doing quite well with the 750. Of course they are thats my favorite Gixxer... but if honda and yami go up to 800 please believe me that Suzuki will do the same!

had to :lol: Who doesn't like the 1000cc shot of semen?? :lol:

MotoGP is reporting that they will be going from the current liter format to an 800cc engine starting next year. They say they are doing it to make it safer, but you would think the manufacturers would be against this. Here's why...MotoGP has always been used as a testbed for new technology and this technology has been geared for current production which has always been the 600cc and the 1000cc. Since there are no 800cc motorcycles, do you all think this is going to make a difference to the engineers and manufacturers? Will there be an 800cc line coming out in the future? Jus a little correction. MotoGP never had 600cc neither 1000cc category. The two strokes were 500cc and the current 4-strokes 990cc. Basically no bike matches on the street to any of the MotoGP bikes. If you guys looking for street equivalent you have to go to Superbike, or Supersport. The MotoGp bikes are completely custom made machines prototypes, basically a speeding R&D laboratory of the future streetbike components. The only part you can find on the streetbikes is the rear brakes(caliper, disc) probably. And the 800cc is true of course its not a rumor.

^^+1. Also i've read that the equivant of a 250cc motogp bikes are a 750 4 stroke. I think Racer X had an article as well on their last issue. Dealt with transitioning of Pedrosa and why they think he is doing well in the motogp level.

^^+1. Also i've read that the equivant of a 250cc motogp bikes are a 750 4 stroke. I think Racer X had an article as well on their last issue. Dealt with transitioning of Pedrosa and why they think he is doing well in the motogp level. Uh...no! A 250cc 2 stroke is about equal to a 500cc 4 stroke. Since there are no 500cc 4 strokes, the closest thing to compair a 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bike to is a 600cc 4 stroke SuperSport bike. Where are you getting this info from? :headscrat

Uh...no! A 250cc 2 stroke is about equal to a 500cc 4 stroke. Since there are no 500cc 4 strokes, the closest thing to compair a 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bike to is a 600cc 4 stroke SuperSport bike. Where are you getting this info from? :headscrat let me look at current issue of Racer X. Said something like that. will get back to you

quote from Jeremy Burgess in Racer X vol. 4 #4 Aug/sept. page 150 & 151Jeremy discussing on the new 800cc motogp bikes with Racer X. Racer X:Do you see it as a rule made to improve safety, or is it a more of a corrective adjustment to what the rule should have been in the first place? Burgess:The thing they were very, very scared of in the beginning was that the two strokes were still going to compete. Because you get one power stroke for every rotation with a two stroke they needed to double that, so essentially, you needed to double the capacity with a four stroke. Everybody with any experience knew that a 750 superbike's lap times were pretty much equitable to the 250 grand prix bikes, so they were faced with another dilemma. They couldn't build a bike that was going to be slower than the superbikes, so they had to build a bike that was going to be quicker than 500s and be faster than the superbikes. So that is were i got my sources from and that is why i stated the 250 motogip were equivalent to 750 superbike. And what i meant by equivalent was the lap times. Next time i guess i should be more clear as to what i say.

opps double post!

quote from Jeremy Burgess in Racer X vol. 4 #4 Aug/sept. page 150 & 151Jeremy discussing on the new 800cc motogp bikes with Racer X. Racer X:Do you see it as a rule made to improve safety, or is it a more of a corrective adjustment to what the rule should have been in the first place? Burgess:The thing they were very, very scared of in the beginning was that the two strokes were still going to compete. Because you get one power stroke for every rotation with a two stroke they needed to double that, so essentially, you needed to double the capacity with a four stroke. Everybody with any experience knew that a 750 superbike's lap times were pretty much equitable to the 250 grand prix bikes, so they were faced with another dilemma. They couldn't build a bike that was going to be slower than the superbikes, so they had to build a bike that was going to be quicker than 500s and be faster than the superbikes. So that is were i got my sources from and that is why i stated the 250 motogip were equivalent to 750 superbike. And what i meant by equivalent was the lap times. Next time i guess i should be more clear as to what i say. These are all 2006 Brno lap times. Hmmm:hmmm: Well, I just pulled the lap times for Brno in the Czech Republic for 2006 and the average lap times on a 250cc MotoGP bike was 2'04.8 and the average lap times on a 600cc SuperSport was 2'06.1 Keep in mind the SuperSport boys are running Pirelli Spec tires which means they don't get the good stuff MotoGP boys get. Here's another interesting fact that I found from Brno in the Czech Republic. Fastest qualifying lap on a 990cc MotoGP bike was 1'57.871 set by the king himself Valentino Rossi and the fastest qualifying lap on a World Superbike was 2'00.08 set by Troy Bayliss again on Pirelli spec tires. To put that into perspective here's another fact: Nicky Hayden ran a 1'59.387 qualifying time on his RC211V MotoGP bike with hand made Michelin tires which is only about .693 seconds faster than Troy Bayliss on his Ducati 999R Superbike with Pirelli Spec tires. The reason why I emphasize the Pirelli spec tires is because MotoGP tires are hand made and there's multiple manufactures involved like Michelin, Bridgestone, Dunlop where as World Superbikes have to run on mass production Pirelli Spec tires (they don't get a choice of different manufactures) so these tires suck compared to MotoGP tires. So in the end it looks like their fears maybe coming true after all. Those 800cc MotoGP bikes may in fact be slower then the World Superbikes next year...We'll just have to wait and see.:thumbup:

mmm... 800 sounds just right for my next bike :thumbup:

These are all 2006 Brno lap times. Hmmm:hmmm: Well, I just pulled the lap times for Brno in the Czech Republic for 2006 and the average lap times on a 250cc MotoGP bike was 2'04.8 and the average lap times on a 600cc SuperSport was 2'06.1 Keep in mind the SuperSport boys are running Pirelli Spec tires which means they don't get the good stuff MotoGP boys get. Here's another interesting fact that I found from Brno in the Czech Republic. Fastest qualifying lap on a 990cc MotoGP bike was 1'57.871 set by the king himself Valentino Rossi and the fastest qualifying lap on a World Superbike was 2'00.08 set by Troy Bayliss again on Pirelli spec tires. To put that into perspective here's another fact: Nicky Hayden ran a 1'59.387 qualifying time on his RC211V MotoGP bike with hand made Michelin tires which is only about .693 seconds faster than Troy Bayliss on his Ducati 999R Superbike with Pirelli Spec tires. The reason why I emphasize the Pirelli spec tires is because MotoGP tires are hand made and there's multiple manufactures involved like Michelin, Bridgestone, Dunlop where as World Superbikes have to run on mass production Pirelli Spec tires (they don't get a choice of different manufactures) so these tires suck compared to MotoGP tires. So in the end it looks like their fears maybe coming true after all. Those 800cc MotoGP bikes may in fact be slower then the World Superbikes next year...We'll just have to wait and see.:thumbup: In retrospec to the new 800cc yes i believe they will fall behind in lap times for next season. Motogp is motogp and will only go further and quicker in development of making the bike go faster touching all aspecs of the bike:engine, chassis and tires. That is where Superbike cannot compete as they have to stick to manufactures specs for the bike and Can only run with pirelli tires A 1 1/3 secs off avg lap time is quite big in a motorcycle race. Granted the 250cc are running in superb tires compared to the supersport. With the comparison you gave the 600cc 4 stroke should have a 100cc advantage over the 250cc 2 stroke since you compared a 250cc 2 stroke to a 500cc 4 stroke. So the 600cc 4 stroke supersport bikes should then be putting up better lap times compared to a 250cc motogp bike? Uh...no! A 250cc 2 stroke is about equal to a 500cc 4 stroke. Since there are no 500cc 4 strokes, the closest thing to compair a 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bike to is a 600cc 4 stroke SuperSport bike. Where are you getting this info from? :headscrat If you stated that 250cc 2 stroke is equal to a 500cc 4 stroke then shouldn't the 600cc 4 stroke supersport be putting up better times since they have an extra 100cc. Instead the 250cc is putting up 1.3 secs faster avg lap times than the supersport like you stated. .

A 1 1/3 secs off avg lap time is quite big in a motorcycle race. Granted the 250cc are running in superb tires compared to the supersport. With the comparison you gave the 600cc 4 stroke should have a 100cc advantage over the 250cc 2 stroke since you compared a 250cc 2 stroke to a 500cc 4 stroke. So the 600cc 4 stroke supersport bikes should then be putting up better lap times compared to a 250cc motogp bike. If you stated that 250cc 2 stroke is equal to a 500cc 4 stroke then the 600cc 4 stroke supersport should put up better times since they have a 100cc extra. Instead the 250cc is putting up 1.3 secs faster avg lap times than the supersport. Yes, 1.3 seconds is a lot in road racing. Tires make a huge difference so you shouldn't be down playin that. A quote from Roadracing World Sept 2006 issue page 94: "The difference between "production" tires and "developement" tires can be one or two seconds a lap." Yes, 600cc PRODUCTION based 4 stroke SuperSport bikes have a 100cc advantage over a pure race PROTOTYPE 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bikes. But the MotoGP bikes are lighter and have no restictions in developement so you are wrong. The 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bikes still have an advantage in performance and tires compaired to 600cc 4 stroke SuperSport bikes.

So if the race PRTOTYPE 250cc motogp bikes have an advantage in performance over 600cc PRODUCTION 4 strokes due to the 250cc being lighter, having better performance, and tires then shouldnt we compare the 250cc motogp bikes with the 750cc 4 strokes? Your saying to me that 600cc are Production bike are limited to development and 250cc motogp bikes are race PROTOTYPE bikes and i agree with you. SO yes the 240cc motogp bikes will be faster. That is why i put up what jeremy Burgess said and i agree to his statement that the equivalent of 250cc motogp bikes are 750cc because 250cc 2 stroke are race PROTOTYPE. its gonna run faster than the 600cc PRODUCTION bike. So how can Nicky Hayden's RC211V RACETYPE Motogp bike be faster in a lap time than troy corsers Production Ducati 999r in only less than a second in Brno? No way in hell do people compare WSB bikes with Motogp bikes. With hand manufactured tires and top notch research and development to a bike one would think nicky should put up faster times than a Production bike. there are other factors involve there such as nicky having always to try on new chassis, claims to have used up 7th chassis this season, and familiarity to the track, nicky sucks at European soil. You asked me where i got my infro from and i told you where i got it from. This is something i did not make up. Jeremy Burgess is a very well accomplished Crew Chief and only stated what he said. So where are you going with this? Then you try to put up lap times and number to justify you cause. If you have any problems with the 250cc motogp bikes being equivalent to 750cc 4 stroke superbikes then you are more than welcome to give Jeremy Burgess a call and state your argument. While your at it kindly ask Mr. Burgess if he thinks Rossi still has a chance in catching NV for the championship.

I am hoping this debate/argument ends here as there is no point to go much further with this topic of 250cc 2-stke=750cc 4-stke. You can PM me if you would like to talk more about this issue. As for motogp bikes going to 800cc i have seen pics of the bike on other forum/ will try to post some pics up

So if the race PRTOTYPE 250cc motogp bikes have an advantage in performance over 600cc PRODUCTION 4 strokes due to the 250cc being lighter, having better performance, and tires then shouldnt we compare the 250cc motogp bikes with the 750cc 4 strokes? Your saying to me that 600cc are Production bike are limited to development and 250cc motogp bikes are race PROTOTYPE bikes and i agree with you. SO yes the 240cc motogp bikes will be faster. That is why i put up what jeremy Burgess said and i agree to his statement that the equivalent of 250cc motogp bikes are 750cc because 250cc 2 stroke are race PROTOTYPE. its gonna run faster than the 600cc PRODUCTION bike. So how can Nicky Hayden's RC211V RACETYPE Motogp bike be faster in a lap time than troy corsers Production Ducati 999r in only less than a second in Brno? No way in hell do people compare WSB bikes with Motogp bikes. With hand manufactured tires and top notch research and development to a bike one would think nicky should put up faster times than a Production bike. there are other factors involve there such as nicky having always to try on new chassis, claims to have used up 7th chassis this season, and familiarity to the track, nicky sucks at European soil. You asked me where i got my infro from and i told you where i got it from. This is something i did not make up. Jeremy Burgess is a very well accomplished Crew Chief and only stated what he said. So where are you going with this? Then you try to put up lap times and number to justify you cause. If you have any problems with the 250cc motogp bikes being equivalent to 750cc 4 stroke superbikes then you are more than welcome to give Jeremy Burgess a call and state your argument. While your at it kindly ask Mr. Burgess if he thinks Rossi still has a chance in catching NV for the championship. :funny: :infrandom Wow, you're a little upset... Simply put, a 750cc 4 stroke Superbike is still faster then a 250cc 2 stroke MotoGP bike. If you don't like my facts then don't read them or respond to them. I believe I've made my point as far as choosing a 600cc 4 stroke to compare to a 250cc 2 stroke. They maybe down by about 1.3 seconds but a good set of "development" tires would change that. This is an open discussion forum and I'm going to use it as it is intended for. If my statements offend you then I apologize as that was not my intention. I'm not going to "PM" you because whatever needs to be said can be done openly. :thumbup:

you statement did not upset me nor am i offended. I like the topics you brought up. But it seems to me you are arguing the facts that i stated from a motogp crew chief. The original thread was about motogp bikes turning to 800cc so i would rather stay on topic with that. Like i stated you can pm me or we can start a thread regarding comparisons of certain bikes and type of compound of tires. I like discussing issues like the one you bring up. It seems you were very dumbfounded that i have brought to you some information that did not seem to fit your criteria. As for comparison's i'll stay with the 250cc motogp bikes equivalent to 750 superbikes due to a very knowledge source i read from. Can he possibly be wrong? yeah sure. Since he has been around motogp bikes for a long time and has been a crew chief of Valentino and Mick i can only believe his statement. As for nick'y fastest lap time in bruno in comparison with baylis fastest lap time in bruno can we assume that with better tires bayliss will pull out a faster time than nicky? Yes. Does that mean a WSB bike is comparible to a motogp bike? No

I heard, and this is ONLY SPECULATION, that because of the move to 800cc the big 4 companies will be able to make their street bikes look like the Moto GP bikes in 1000cc class. Because everything used in the Gran Prix is supposed to be prototype they were not allowed to mock the look for mass produced bikes. Now they may be able to make future bike models look like those bikes since they won't be in use again. Like I said only a rumor may or may not be true. What do you all think? I know yamaha produced some street legal M1s in Europe last year with the LE but they were super expensive and made only a couple to release. they were all bought up by the super rich obviously. And Ducati made a Desmo street legal look a like. So I don't know, but it would be cool to see those flush fairing on stock street bikes. Well Yamaha just tested there 800cc bikes after the Czech Rep. race at Bruno in the rain and in the dry. So the speculation is that they are already here. Honda is testing after the race in Japan at Motegi.