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Old 11-20-2005, 10:11 AM   #1
irishroads
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Question advice ?suspension settings gsxr 600 k5

hi ,i bought a gsxr 600 k5 and need some advice on suspension settings ,,, i'm 5 10' and weight around 182lbs . i'm currently on standard settings can i set suspension to suit my weight ????
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Old 11-20-2005, 08:53 PM   #2
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Correct me if I'm wrong but I do believe the suspension is set for 180lbs riders off the assembly line. It may not be the tight race set up.
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Old 11-21-2005, 07:51 AM   #3
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I would have a pro do it, it is worth the money. You could fool around with it and make it worse. I brought my gixxer from a guy who was 160 lbs. I am 175. I found the way he had it set up was too stiff. I took the bike too the shop and sure enough the settings were way off. The front was way too stiff and the back was too soft. He asked me my weight, had me sit on it and set it up in like 15 minutes. It was the best 30 bucks I spent on the bike. It rode like a different bike. Having your suspension set up professionally is one of the best mods you can have done on your bike!
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Old 11-21-2005, 10:38 AM   #4
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Quote:
Originally Posted by hustleman
Correct me if I'm wrong but I do believe the suspension is set for 180lbs riders off the assembly line. It may not be the tight race set up.
More like 160-170
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Old 11-21-2005, 10:44 AM   #5
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Originally Posted by JFM GSXR 750
I would have a pro do it, it is worth the money. You could fool around with it and make it worse. I brought my gixxer from a guy who was 160 lbs. I am 175. I found the way he had it set up was too stiff. I took the bike too the shop and sure enough the settings were way off. The front was way too stiff and the back was too soft. He asked me my weight, had me sit on it and set it up in like 15 minutes. It was the best 30 bucks I spent on the bike. It rode like a different bike. Having your suspension set up professionally is one of the best mods you can have done on your bike!
Correct , a properly set up suspension for the riders style of riding (street/commuting only or psycho twisty/canyon carving) is the way to go. I laugh when my friends ride my bike, they get off it and can't figure out how I can stand it. Talk about stiff, I weigh 150lbs and have .95 springs in the front (which is for a 200lb rider) but you should see me on my brakes coming into a turn. I can compress my forks to the point where only about 1/4" - 1/2" of fork travel is left
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Old 11-21-2005, 06:16 PM   #6
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thanks for the advice ... the roads here are very unforgiven any mistakes and your off so correct setup is a must have , guess i'll leave it to tas suzuki who road race here to sort something out for me .
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Old 11-21-2005, 07:02 PM   #7
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Originally Posted by you da man
More like 160-170
correctamundo!

But yea, its worth it! Get it done!
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Old 11-21-2005, 08:15 PM   #8
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i need to look into this too....i'm 200-210lbs....depending on time of year HAHAHAHA

(damn near 220lbs. after thanksgiving/x-mas i'm sure)....the rear feels like it needs a little stiffening
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Old 11-22-2005, 07:41 AM   #9
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i need to look into this too....i'm 200-210lbs....depending on time of year HAHAHAHA

(damn near 220lbs. after thanksgiving/x-mas i'm sure)....the rear feels like it needs a little stiffening
For whatever reason Suzuki sets the shock really soft. Before my shock rebuild my tuner, Marcus McBain at Racing Performance Services, said my stock shock was too soft for even my skinny 150lb. ass. You will probably need .95 springs but if you like a cushy ride then get .90. Stock is around .78-.80 compression.
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Old 11-22-2005, 07:45 AM   #10
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Originally Posted by you da man
For whatever reason Suzuki sets the shock really soft. Before my shock rebuild my Marcus McBain at Racing Performance Services said my stock shock was too soft for even my skinny 150lb. ass. You will probably need .95 springs but if you like a cushy ride then get .90. Stock is around .78-.80 compression.

so they'll actually change the spring itself? or are they just adjusting the preload on the stock shock??

OR..are they completely reassembling the shock tower with diff. internals for the weight?
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Old 11-22-2005, 08:11 AM   #11
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so they'll actually change the spring itself? or are they just adjusting the preload on the stock shock??

OR..are they completely reassembling the shock tower with diff. internals for the weight?
For me, I had the shock revalved with Racetech gold valve kit and he actually did a little extra drilling in the ports to get the rebound to catch up with the rebound in the forks. He said the rear will lag in the rebound even when revalved unless you do the extra drilling of the ports. He further explained that if the rear was still compressed coming out of a turn when the forks have already rebounded, the result would be running wide on the exits of turns. Even though my tuner is an authorized Racetech technician (also he is contracted by a couple AMA teams as well as the top CMRA guys) he is not fond of their stuff. He prefers Traxxion Dynamics for the forks and Penske/Ohlins for the rear. My tuner said the stock spring was fine for me. I would guess you would have to go heavier since you are like 50-60lbs heavier than me.
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Old 11-22-2005, 08:31 AM   #12
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ok, but what i'm asking is...does it NEED to be revalved (is it necessary to revalve for weight?), or is this something i can prolly do myself??? i'm pretty mechanically inclined, but i dont wanna rebuild my whole shock assembly if i can just mess with the stock settings by giving the rear "coilover" sleeve a few cranks.....
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Old 11-22-2005, 08:43 AM   #13
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usdm420
ok, but what i'm asking is...does it NEED to be revalved (is it necessary to revalve for weight?), or is this something i can prolly do myself??? i'm pretty mechanically inclined, but i dont wanna rebuild my whole shock assembly if i can just mess with the stock settings by giving the rear "coilover" sleeve a few cranks.....
You can probably add some preload to it to make it stiffer but keep in mind these bikes were not set up for 200 pounders from the factory so I don't know if you can add that much preload. I would just get a heavier spring from Penske or Eibach ($100-ish). It's not necessary to revalve unless you are track riding alot or doing some crazy carving. Revalving allows the oil to flow faster during the compression and rebound phase of the shocks movement due to the larger ports in the new valve, lighter oil helps to.
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Old 11-22-2005, 08:53 AM   #14
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Originally Posted by you da man
You can probably add some preload to it to make it stiffer but keep in mind these bikes were not set up for 200 pounders from the factory so I don't know if you can add that much preload. I would just get a heavier spring from Penske or Eibach ($100-ish). It's not necessary to revalve unless you are track riding alot or doing some crazy carving. Revalving allows the oil to flow faster during the compression and rebound phase of the shocks movement due to the larger ports in the new valve, lighter oil helps to.

thanks for the explanation bro' i was always good with motors, but never touched my suspensions hahaha

i always paid shops to setup my cars, which is always the best idea...but i'll see how much diff. i can do with simple pre-load adjustments for now..that $100 will be better off towards x-mas shopping for now. :2hard
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Old 11-22-2005, 09:07 AM   #15
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Originally Posted by usdm420
thanks for the explanation bro' i was always good with motors, but never touched my suspensions hahaha

i always paid shops to setup my cars, which is always the best idea...but i'll see how much diff. i can do with simple pre-load adjustments for now..that $100 will be better off towards x-mas shopping for now. :2hard
Speaking of X-mas shopping, you know how friends/family always say they don't know what to get you for a gift and you usually say just get me whatever. Well, last X-mas and my B-day I just told everyone to get me gift certificates from Kneedraggers.com. I made out like a fat rat and had over $400 worth of certificates.
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Old 11-22-2005, 09:12 AM   #16
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Speaking of X-mas shopping, you know how friends/family always say they don't know what to get you for a gift and you usually say just get me whatever. Well, last X-mas and my B-day I just told everyone to get me gift certificates from Kneedraggers.com. I made out like a fat rat and had over $400 worth of certificates.

hmmmmmm not a bad idea there partner..maybe "suspension tuning" should be on my wish list
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Old 11-22-2005, 09:15 AM   #17
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Quote:
Originally Posted by usdm420
hmmmmmm not a bad idea there partner..maybe "suspension tuning" should be on my wish list
Or hold off on the suspension tweaking and talk to your suspension guy and see what he recommends, then ask for that for Christmas and then do the tuning.
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Old 01-29-2006, 05:47 PM   #18
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Hey, I found this on another forum...thought it might help some of you out too...I like to tinker, so this is worthwhile to me.


The first step is setting proper sag. This simply refers to how much the bike 'sags' when you sit on it. Sag is always measured from the fully extended position. Lever the wheel off the ground, measure, sit on the bike and measure again: That's "Rider Sag." "Static Sag" is how much the bike sags all by itself. Putting a zip-tie around one of the fork legs simplifies measurement and can be left in place so you can see how much suspension you are using.

Since damping can/will effect your readings, you should set sag with the damping dialed to fully soft. Be sure and write down your settings so you can return to them when you are done.

Youll need 2 people to help you do it accurately, but the mechanics of setting sag are simple: One person levers the back of the bike off the ground on the sidestand and front wheel, while a second person measures the total available travel of the swingarm from the axle to whatever part of the bodywork/frame is convenient. It is important that you pick a spot thats directly above the axle. I like to write an X on a piece of masking tape to be sure Im measuring the same thing every time. Write that number down, as it is your baseline. Then you sit on your bike in your normal riding position, ideally wearing your gear. One helper steadies the bike, while the other repeats the measurement you just made. Subtract the second number from the first, and youll have the amount the bike is actually sagging under your weight. Add or subtract spring tension at the shock until you get the number you are looking for. That accomplished, you would then repeat the process for the front forks. As I mentioned above, a zip tie around the swept area simplifies measurements.

For a streetbike, I've found that 40mm up front and 30mm in the rear is a good place to start. Track mavens would/should start around 30/20~25. Since it's the more important, set rider sag first, and then go back and check static sag - The bike *should* sag a little by itself: 5~10mm is good. If you have proper rider sag but no static sag, then you have to wind your springs too tight, and you should install heavier springs. More than 10mm static sag and you should think about going to a lighter spring.

If you want to be really precise, you'll factor in suspension 'stiction' as well. Stiction refers to the amount the suspension sticks because of internal friction. With the bike roughly dialed in, and you sitting in riding position, have a buddy press down on the triple, and release. Measure. Then have him lift UP on the front and allow the bike to settle again. Take the average and use that as your baseline. A 0~5mm difference is considered very good. More than 5~10mm is OK, but you might check your methodology and look for things that might be misaligned. If you're closing on 15mm of stiction or more, you have a real problem and should take your bike to a pro for a rebuild. (But you probably already knew that 'cause your bike handles like crap!!!) Repeat for the rear.


NEAT SAG TRICK: Put your bike into a long fast sweeper on neutral throttle and relax your grip on the bars as much as you dare. The bike will likely make a movement:

If it falls into the turn: You are setup favoring initial turn in over side to side flickability. Add front preload to move to neutral.

If it stands up: You are setup favoring side to side movements over initial turn-in. Remove front preload to more to neutral.

Where you end up with that is rider preference. Note: The movement I'm describing should be slow. If the bike darts one way or the other, then you should head back to the garage and re-check what you've done.

Since doing the job properly takes a couple buddies, it makes sense to do everyone's bike at the same time.


Damping Settings

Once you have set your springs properly, then you can move on to damping. You *did* write down your settings when you set sag, right!?!?! Normally, your owner's manual will have some baseline settings, but if that's not available, you'll have to come up with your own.

I'll start with Rebound: A ballpark 'Guesstimate' is shove down on the front while holding the brake and allow the bike to spring back on it's own - It should rise back up, but make NO additional movement. If it does, add rebound. If it does not, take rebound away until it does, then add back just enough to stop the excess movement. Rear rebound: Shove down on the back of the bike, no brakes: It should take about 1 second to rise back up.

Compression settings are more open to interpretation. I like JUST enough up front to stop excess diving on the brakes. You'll have to ride to determine that - try 1 turn from full soft and play from there. You'll want to balance the front and rear, though - Bounce lightly and heavily on the bike with both brakes on and have a buddy stand off to the side watching you. Interfere with the bike's movement as little as you possibly can: Your buddy is watching that both ends of the bike rise and fall together.

VERY IMPORTANT - Suspension tuning is an iterative process, meaning that 1) as you make changes, the changes you make may require to tweak a little more, 2) As you progress as a rider, your damping requirements will change (generally stiffer the more aggressively you ride), and 3) Riding in different situations requires different settings: Most obviously one setup for the street and another for trackdays. Even then, as you improve, your trackday settings will likely change as well. What works when you're running 1:55's may not control the bike properly when you up the pace to 1:53s.

This little fact of life means that it is very important to keep track of your suspension settings and what changes you make over time. That will ensure you can play around with different setups and still be able to return to where the bike was before should you need to. Those who may be REALLY serious would also add columns to their notebook about the specific results the changes they made gave them. That's not necessary for most riders, though. But DEFINITELY keep a little notebook - You won't remember your settings.
TOO MUCH REBOUND (REAR)

- Wheel tends to hop in turns with small bumps

- Wheel skips too much when braking on rippled pavement. Does not develop good braking power

- Poor rear traction when accelerating over small bumps or rippled pavement


Shock may 'Pack Down' - Too much damping keeps the wheel from extending enough before the next

- Suspension Gets harsh over medium or large rolling-type bumps at speed

- The first few don't feel bad, but after that the suspension gets harsh and starts jumping around

- Rear and can Pack In under acceleration, causing the bike to run wide under power

- Rear "Swims" under hard braking


TOO LITTLE REBOUND (REAR)

- Bike wallows when exiting corners or in long rolling dips in sweepers

- Bike feels soft or vague

- Rear pogo or chatter on corner exits, general loss of traction, and tire overheating

Rear Compression

TOO MUCH COMPRESSION (Rear)

- Suspension seems rigid, instead of absorbing

- Suspension is harsh over small bumps

- Wheel skips when braking hard on rippled surfaces

- Very little squat - Loss of traction/sliding

- Tire overheating

- Suspension is harsh over pavement changes

- Shock stays too rigid and doesn't use enough travel to absorb bumps

- Shock rarely or never seems to bottom out Even on the biggest bumps

- Bike Kicks on large bumps


TOO LITTLE COMPRESSION (REAR)

- Shock bottoms out on Medium-sized bumps

- Rear squats under acceleration

- Bike doesn't want to turn upon corner entry

- Excessive Squat under power UNDERSTEER
Front Rebound

TOO MUCH REBOUND (FRONT)

- Front end feels 'Locked Up,' Harsh Ride Quality

- Suspension packs in and fails to return Typically after the first bump, the bike will skip over following bumps and want to tuck the front

- Bike prone to Headshake and Tankslapping upon hard acceleration



TOO LITTLE REBOUND (FRONT)

- Forks are plush, but increasing speed causes loss of control and traction

- Bike wallows and tends to RUN WIDE EXITING turns

- Front end CHATTER, loss of Traction

- Slow to recover on Aggressive Input

- Wheel KICKS BACK on large bumps


Front Compression

TOO MUCH COMPRESSION (FRONT)

- Front End tends to ride high through corners, causing the bike to steer wide

- Suspension is harsh over small bumps

- Front end Chatter on corner entry

- Bumps and ripples are felt directly

- Suspension is generally harsh, and gets worse on braking and entering turns

- Forks don't use enough suspension to properly absorb bumps

- Forks never seem to bottom out, even on large hits

- General lack of traction can cause overheating tires


TOO LITTLE COMPRESSION (FRONT)

- Front end DIVES SEVERELY

- Front feels Soft or Vague

- Bottoms out on medium-sized bumps

- *Clunk* can be heard upon bottoming
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Old 01-29-2006, 07:45 PM   #19
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^ good info bro.
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Old 01-29-2006, 07:59 PM   #20
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No problem, figured if I need it then 20 other people probably do too
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Old 01-29-2006, 09:09 PM   #21
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yea suspension is where it's at
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Old 01-29-2006, 09:38 PM   #22
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^^^ yeah, and unfortunately it's the one mod that is never quite finished...christ...I think I am going to play around with it myself until the begining of march, and then see what I think and take it in to a professional right before spring break... That way I know exactly what I want done before I go and fork down cash and make it worse...

Hey, do any of you know of a good suspension guy in southern ohio, northern kentucky, or west virginia? basically, I don't mind riding 300-400 miles or so, but don't want to trailer my baby to get her worked on...
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