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Discussion Starter #1
I posted in my LiterBike 2.0 thread about one of my winter projects a few months ago, about trying the PAIR valve sucker mod I had heard/read about.

Then, the usual suspects of course gave me at least 15 ways I could plug the PAIR valve, etc.- It's in my thread.

I've been riding with the Pair Valve Sucker Mod since this last winter break- w/ no problems.
To review- the 'MOD'- this one actually makes more HP/TQ- dyno proven by me today!
Take the Crankcase breather hose- usually ends to the air box to vent.
extend it- new hose, etc. to a 'T' fitting up at the PAIR valves on the top of the valve/engine cover.
The Hoses that go to the selenoid, and then to the air cleaner box- get rid of those.
Use appropriate size hoses from the 'T' to each of the PAIR reed valves.
* I am too cheap to Buy a bypass resister, and too lazy to make my own; so I just leave the PAIR solenoid with the wires from the harness attached- doing nothing. This way, no FI light!

This is really a MOD- that increases HP/TQ, for next to nothing $$ wise.

OK- Dynoed the Pair Valve Sucker mod today:

So, nearly +6HP (5.78) and +3 Ft/Lbs (3.26) Increase- with the Pair sucker Mod!
Same day, Back to back dyno runs, same dyno.

Actually more HP increase than I had read on bike threads!

Here are before and after dyno, same day, same dyno, bike never left the dyno to Plug, then hook back up.
We actually wanted to see that A/F ratio, to see if it made a difference.
++ My K5 has NO O2 sensor- cannot correct the mixture on the fly.
** This MOD does NOT change the A/F mixture the combustion chamber sees; b/c the Pair sucker mod ONLY puts a small amount of air, ON THE EXHAUST SIDE ONLY!!
But if your bike HAS an O2 sensor (newer models)- then this Could mess with that system, BUT
That being said:
The A/F ratios were virtually identical: Plugged, or PAIR valve sucker Mod anyways!

Here are the dynos:
PAIR valve plugged:


PAIR valve Sucker mod operational:


If you have a bike with a PAIR valve system, and you haven't already 'blocked it off' with some expensive little carbon fiber or billet plates, or doing it easy with a marble, plug, etc., You're leaving some easy/LOW $ HP on the table.

Do what you want.
I'm really glad I had read up on this and kept reading it was good for a dyno proven ~ 2 hp on a motor like mine.
Low, Low cost of some tubing, and 'T' fitting- and I got nearly 6 HP for it! 6 RWHP!
 

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I posted in my LiterBike 2.0 thread about one of my winter projects a few months ago, about trying the PAIR valve sucker mod I had heard/read about.

Then, the usual suspects of course gave me at least 15 ways I could plug the PAIR valve, etc.- It's in my thread.

I've been riding with the Pair Valve Sucker Mod since this last winter break- w/ no problems.
To review- the 'MOD'- this one actually makes more HP/TQ- dyno proven by me today!
Take the Crankcase breather hose- usually ends to the air box to vent.
extend it- new hose, etc. to a 'T' fitting up at the PAIR valves on the top of the valve/engine cover.
The Hoses that go to the selenoid, and then to the air cleaner box- get rid of those.
Use appropriate size hoses from the 'T' to each of the PAIR reed valves.
* I am too cheap to Buy a bypass resister, and too lazy to make my own; so I just leave the PAIR solenoid with the wires from the harness attached- doing nothing. This way, no FI light!

This is really a MOD- that increases HP/TQ, for next to nothing $$ wise.

OK- Dynoed the Pair Valve Sucker mod today:

So, nearly +6HP (5.78) and +3 Ft/Lbs (3.26) Increase- with the Pair sucker Mod!
Same day, Back to back dyno runs, same dyno.

Actually more HP increase than I had read on bike threads!

Here are before and after dyno, same day, same dyno, bike never left the dyno to Plug, then hook back up.
We actually wanted to see that A/F ratio, to see if it made a difference.
++ My K5 has NO O2 sensor- cannot correct the mixture on the fly.
** This MOD does NOT change the A/F mixture the combustion chamber sees; b/c the Pair sucker mod ONLY puts a small amount of air, ON THE EXHAUST SIDE ONLY!!
But if your bike HAS an O2 sensor (newer models)- then this Could mess with that system, BUT
That being said:
The A/F ratios were virtually identical: Plugged, or PAIR valve sucker Mod anyways!

Here are the dynos:
PAIR valve plugged:


PAIR valve Sucker mod operational:


If you have a bike with a PAIR valve system, and you haven't already 'blocked it off' with some expensive little carbon fiber or billet plates, or doing it easy with a marble, plug, etc., You're leaving some easy/LOW $ HP on the table.

Do what you want.
I'm really glad I had read up on this and kept reading it was good for a dyno proven ~ 2 hp on a motor like mine.
Low, Low cost of some tubing, and 'T' fitting- and I got nearly 6 HP for it! 6 RWHP!
Hi Todd
I have the same bike,atm I'm running some rod questions due the bolts.
I have the normal pair mod done/block off.
Doing the sucker mod, won't you get more excess gung from the vapours into your parts?
Back then is did see this mod from bugmans web I think page doesn't exist anymore.
6hp for this mod sounds good.
Have you flashed your ECU?

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Discussion Starter #3
My motor currently has about 24,000 miles on it. There is no oil vapor blow by -visible anyway. This only sucks air out of the exhaust port. It does not go through your combustion chamber whatsoever. It’s after the exhaust valve in the head.
Yes I have a flashed ECU, Which really only cleans things up some. When you look at my AF ratio, this you see it first runs slightly lean is because - tech said you’re whacking the throttle open in fifth or sixth gear andin this case it was sixth gear and it has a rush of air leaning it out slightly. It did that with the PAIR valve was blocked or was hooked up to the crank case breather.
I hope you get your issues worked out with your bike.
 

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Great, next time the bike is one piece will upgrade that pair mod, I read long time ago someone did it and all he got was a lot of gunk carbon on the exhaust valves, now that you have done a good check on this it's more clear.
Once I get the parts for my bike will start reassembly...but the currier here is shit at best.

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Discussion Starter #5
Thanks Dany,
I had read that to possibly help, watch that the motor only has the Max amount of oil in the site glass? I usually ran mine with more than that- and for no reason really.
Since this mod, I am running no higher than the top line of the site glass- that somehow may help with oil blow by residue? I read some posts that seem to indicate that.

I'll be keeping an eye on my Yoshi Carbon exhaust for any signs of of residue build up.

So far- golden! From those dynos yesterday, I Know my a/f is spot on. Plugging the Pair valve system- as any good dyno tuner often does so it supposedly does not affect the A/F reading?
My was nearly identical, plugged, or pain valve sucker mod- virtually the same A/F readings! And yes- it was 'sucking' a vacuum on the crankcase- b/c it gained nearly 6 peak HP. Easy to do, there for the taking. My 2 cents. YMMV
 

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Normally when I Dyno bikes I do the pair block off as it is recommended by the software developer to avoid a false reading, so far I have will have to test what are reading I get with it on and another without it.
Some ecu I can block off by software and others not, our bike I can't do this by software, now there is also the decel fuelcut disable option, once bike is done will see how this affects my one, on other bikes I do this they become smooth when getting back to power and not so jerky from a roll off - on.

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Discussion Starter #7
Yep, one of the features of my 'flash' was deleting the fuel cut thing.
It also makes all the gear maps the same as the higher gears- thus eliminating any timing retards, etc.
My bike is really smooth, and when I take my hands off the bars (my throttle cables snap back instantly), it doesn't throw me over the front of the bike like it used to.
 

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Discussion Starter #9
What af are you targeting?

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Pretty much right where my A/F ratio is now, what is it, 13. something? I'm not targeting. Didn't waste my money on a 'power commander'. Sounds good, Commands Power- and I am sure for some bikes, it may be worth it.
When I take out, look at my Plugs after 600-1000+ miles, they still look like new!

I have a 'mail ECU in' flash, based on what he had as references, and my specific mods- which are all external to the engine.
If my guy doing my dyno runs tells me it's near spot on, I'm not arguing with this guy. I'm not worthy.
If he tells me a PC might get me 1 more HP somewhere, it Ain't worth it- for me and my system anyways. I do have a flashed ECU.

He actually did four pulls each way yesterday, 4 with it blocked off, and 4 with the sucker mod. He left the 2 best ones on each graph. The other two deleted were within 1 HP and 1 ft/lb anyway. So no need to add them. They were all with in the margin of error. This guy forgot more than I'll ever know about tuning bikes, getting a knee down, etc.
We did the Blocked Pair runs first. You should have seen his face when after the first PAIR sucker mod run when he toggled the screen to max #s. Even he was shocked!

So many had posted that this mod really wasn't worth it, based on objective facts,
I beg to differ.
 

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Discussion Starter #10
Well my crappy Computer won't let me open an edit page now.

Based on your question about a/f ratio,

I would like to sway that my Dyno Tech/guru guy does a pull in one gear. These were in sixth gear.
He says that at 45mph, he whacks open the throttle, and it takes it a few seconds to 'catch up', hence the slightly lean environment in a Big gear at low speeds. It's not really what the engine ever sees in real time #'s.
It quickly catches up in this situation and has a near optimal a/f ratio. Good enough for me and what I'm doing.
Better than I'd expect actually for my needs.
 

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Discussion Starter #11
This has only been on here about a day. Obviously not many are impressed, however; 😜

I posted a lot about doing it to my ride, and posted how I did it, etc.

I had read for bikes, mostly on 600's for some reason- it was worth a reproducible 2HP.

I posted real #'s, on my bascially stock internals K5 1000- that I got nearly 6 hp!
It is reproducible. It was warmed up and did 4 pulls each way, sucker mod, or plugged PAIR valve.

I can't think my bike/set up is really that much different than others.
I didn't put on of those silly 'water traps' in the line either!- to catch any oil residue. If your bike has that much blow by residue- I don't think you need this mod to begin with?

A simple, 5+ HP, for next to no $.

A stock, original K5 Liter that has 24k miles on it, with all external only mods- simple ones like a slip on, air cleaner, and a generic- mail in flash- putting down 161 RWHP? Not too shabby. Not a 'happy dyno' either.

You're welcome.
😜
 

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That’s a very impressive dyno from a K5. I guess the mileage hasn’t affected this machines health at all. Even a new 2020 GSXR 1000 puts down like 180? I’d love to see you dyno the bike with like 40-50k miles on it. keep on driving it!
 

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I'm not running any standalone line pcv or rapid,I flash the original ecu based on what values I get, doing some timing and fueling under others, I do have some work done to the engine and now it's completely out due to a rebuild and project I'm doing.
The 13/1 afr ratio is the default if I'm not wrong in the software target, near a stoichiometry value (suppose to be 14,7/1) I tend to run some richer values but of course lost of shit comes into play, temp, humidity,air density/pressure etc etc etc...
These are my Dyno results but this is not a stock,did some headwork and tons of tests before getting here, when I first Dyno the bike I had a ver bad case of diarrhea...the supused good bike I bought from a colleague was a .
The pair sucker mod will be done that's now a fact.
Is the 2020 not the same bike as the 2018? Did two of those,once the exhaust line is changed and decat...the idle becomes a biatch at least in my case...managed to solve that and done a some timing and fueling, the guy is now running a mf smile....
Todd, are you using silicon hoses from vent to pair ?


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Discussion Starter #14
Hey Dany,
Nice #'s if I'm reading it correctly.

The 17+ motor has the VVT- whole different motor I thought.

No, not silicone hoses, I'm using black hose that's made for gas/oil/heat.- from auto parts store
 

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That's more than good
Can't wait to get all the parts that are still to be delivered but with fkin covid ages ages here

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Discussion Starter #16
Good luck. Keep us up to date with your K5 build!
 

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Discussion Starter #18
Back to my PAIR valve sucker mod.

I did read at least one post, that mentioned the low oil pressure light would occasionally come on with this mod?

I also read at least one saying if they didn't run the oil level middle to lower level, they'd get some oil smoke out the exhaust pipe?

I bring this up, because the last time on my 'long way home from work', I was downshifting to stop at a stop sign where I had just had the bike ~ 8-11K on several turns in the nice road.
I looked down and saw the red light- assuming that was low oil pressure light flicker on and off a few times.

Well, in the typical OzzyMan review style (if you don't know of these, check out his YouTube channel- Funniest stuff I've ever heard.)
I said 'Fuck Me'. The light did not stay on. I revved a bit, no light. I eased over on some more twisties, at lower R's and stopped at the next T intersection.
I tried to hold the bike vertical while looking into the glass window at the oil level. Have you ever tried to do that on the side of the road? No easy- didn't drop it.
It was well above the bottom line.
I kept riding. Watching for the light- never saw it again.

I got home, put the bike on the center stand after a few minutes and checked the oil in the window glass. Plenty of oil!

No evidence of oil like smoke from the exhaust, no residue or smoke, etc.

Never saw the light again, and it's running fine, etc.

This may not have anything to do with the Mod on this thread. But because I remember reading a few, isolated 'con' posts to this mod, I thought I'd bring it up.
 

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Discussion Starter #19
Either nobody reads any of this- that I understand; or they don't have any suggestions.
I'll keep an wy out for that blinking red light again.
 

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Are you asking for help with the red light or just commenting on your situation? This post is kind of hard to understand in some ways. There are a lot of problems with grammar which makes for a hard read, then the long drawn out comments make for an even harder read. I suggest cleaning up the results portion of this regarding the PAIR/Sucker MOD, then starting a new thread for the red light.
 
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